53 - The Six Purposes of Marriage: Completeness

[00:00:01] Hi everyone, welcome to The Cult I Left Behind podcast. I'm your host, Amanda Briggs, and

[00:00:08] I'm here to tell you my stories of growing up in the IBLP cult which you might know from

[00:00:14] the Duggar family.

[00:00:15] And I'm your other host, Kyle Briggs. I am Amanda's husband and I have not heard most

[00:00:20] of these stories before so stay tuned and we'll all get traumatized together.

[00:00:30] Alright, welcome back to the next episode. What do you have for us today Amanda?

[00:00:35] Well, we have Marriage Purpose Number 3 which is completeness.

[00:00:39] Can only imagine what this one's gonna be like.

[00:00:44] I don't know. This doesn't make a whole lot of sense and it's short so I figured we'd go through

[00:00:49] this and then get caught up on some of the backlog of questions and then just go ponder

[00:00:59] the meaning of life and have an existential crisis like I usually do after I go here to

[00:01:05] Bill. So what have we got here? Completeness is bringing together a marriage what God divided

[00:01:13] in creation.

[00:01:17] I don't remember that being part of the creation story.

[00:01:21] Well, he took part of Adam to make Eve then brought her to him as his completion.

[00:01:25] When Adam saw Eve, he immediately recognized this purpose and said this is now bone of my

[00:01:29] bone and flesh of my flesh. She shall be called woman because she was taken out of man.

[00:01:39] I'm not gonna go into all of the Hebrew. There's some controversy in that whole origin story

[00:01:47] and how it has been translated because of misogyny and the patriarchy.

[00:01:53] The word complete is an absolute term and cannot be qualified by further adjectives such as more or

[00:02:01] most. You cannot be more complete or most complete. You are just complete. This rules out the adding

[00:02:11] of another wife to the marriage and rules out the potential of greater fulfillment

[00:02:16] and extramarital relationships. But I need to go back to marriage is bringing together a

[00:02:27] marriage what God divided in creation. So Bill's saying that because he took Adam apart to make

[00:02:32] Eve, then that is symbolic of all of us when men and wife come together. You never get my

[00:02:42] princess bride references and it just breaks my heart every time. You're gonna have to watch it more.

[00:02:48] My heart isn't complete now, Kyle. It's broken. I will admit I have not seen that movie enough

[00:02:56] to remember all the quotes. So then we have the principle spiritual power. I don't know how

[00:03:04] does that relate? Okay, when two come together in spiritual oneness they multiply their potential

[00:03:09] and power in the Lord. They will be able to accomplish great spiritual achievements through

[00:03:14] prayer since God promised. If two of you shall agree on earth is touching anything that they

[00:03:21] shall ask it shall be done for them of which or of my father which is in heaven. I hate King James.

[00:03:29] It's really weird to me that my brain used to thinking King James and like understand it.

[00:03:33] I could never understand it even when you're reading it. I'm like, I don't know what's

[00:03:37] happening. Well, and then that's also taken out of context as well. I believe Matthew 1819,

[00:03:45] but Bill wanted the verse there so he put it there to prove that it's spiritual power.

[00:03:52] And then of course we have God's hidden quote design. Oh, so what Bill thinks? This is Bill.

[00:03:59] Bill, key is oneness and spirit. Oh, the weaker vessel makes an appearance.

[00:04:08] Of course. Likewise ye husbands dwell with them according to knowledge giving honor unto the wife

[00:04:16] as unto the weaker vessel and as being heirs together of the grace of life that your prayers

[00:04:22] be not hindered. I still don't understand the weaker vessel thing. Like,

[00:04:29] yeah, I just don't get it even in. I don't either. Yeah, I think I used to know a lot about that,

[00:04:39] but I have brain dumped that. I just don't hang out with people who, you know,

[00:04:46] demean women. I guess the confusing like the part I can't figure out and maybe

[00:04:52] I just need to go Google it is like, what is it about women that class that they think

[00:04:58] classify them as weaker vessels? Is it like physical strength or is it like something else?

[00:05:06] I think in some cases they were talking about being physically weaker like probably Bill,

[00:05:12] definitely theologians like John Piper. But what I'm seeing here, I did a quick Google search

[00:05:21] like the more progressive theologians are saying that it's like honor your wives as you would care

[00:05:31] for something more fragile or weaker vessel likely carries the meaning of worth protecting

[00:05:38] and something to cherish. That's from gotquestions.org and the one about fragile was

[00:05:44] Bible ref.com. So I think, I don't know, it varies. I kind of expected that that's what it was.

[00:05:53] There's not like a clear definition there but it's whatever works for men in the moment to

[00:05:59] accomplish what they want. That's usually how that one gets interpreted. Yes, by the guys

[00:06:06] that are trying to control women. Yes. Yes. So how is Satan attacking the quote hidden design

[00:06:14] of marriage completeness? Satan's goal is to damage the spirit of the marriage.

[00:06:21] For all you married people out there, that's what Satan's trying to do to you.

[00:06:24] How does concupiscence damage the spirit of a marriage? I had to look up that word. It means

[00:06:30] like lust or strong desire. So why can't you just say lust? I don't know. I've never heard

[00:06:35] that one. You have to say concupiscence. Yeah. How does that damage the spirit of a marriage?

[00:06:41] Marriage spirit is damaged when either party feels used according to Ephesians 529.

[00:06:48] The husband is to view his wife as an extension of himself and to protect her

[00:06:52] as he would protect himself for no man ever yet hated his own flesh but nourisheth it

[00:07:01] and cherisheth it even as the Lord the Church. I guess that means like even as the Lord nourisheth

[00:07:13] cherishes. I can't say that right now. How is the spirit of the marriage deepened?

[00:07:22] Marriage spirit is deepened through the word and prayer. Why is oneness essential for prayer?

[00:07:31] Tremendous power is available when to agree in prayer. And then we have how can abstinence

[00:07:39] strengthen oneness? How Kyle, how do you think abstinence strengthens oneness?

[00:07:47] I see he's got some twisted reason why abstinence gives them clarity or connection.

[00:07:57] They connect through abstinence. Well, all he says is times of abstinence are to be used

[00:08:04] for prayer and fasting. Are there other times when you're supposed to pray during sex?

[00:08:11] I mean, I'm just the opposite of that would be

[00:08:15] I think a lot of people do cry out to the divine during sex but I don't think that.

[00:08:25] I don't think that's what they're talking about here. I think it's hilarious that like

[00:08:31] in the rest of life you talk like I talk and I don't really but then when we do the podcast

[00:08:37] I talk like you talk and then you blush. Yes, there's people listening.

[00:08:48] It's okay. They're grown ups. That's all we got. Yeah, times of abstinence are to be used for prayer

[00:08:56] and fasting. So if you want to become one with your spouse don't have sex with them,

[00:09:03] fail to eat instead and pray. Fail to eat? Fast. Oh, fast in abstinence.

[00:09:12] So you're not having sex, you're not having food. You're just praying. Okay.

[00:09:19] I feel like the Bethel should make an appearance here.

[00:09:22] No, you can't be on your own for this part. Oh, that's true. This is completeness.

[00:09:26] So she's not allowed to be part of the Bethel though. No, no, that is just for the man.

[00:09:32] He needs his quiet place.

[00:09:34] Hmm. Further insights on completeness.

[00:09:42] Completeness is prompted by a servant's spirit working to make the partner successful.

[00:09:48] An important resource for completeness is deepened by helping each other identify and

[00:09:55] develop spiritual gifts. Oh yeah, spiritual gifts make another appearance.

[00:09:59] Mm hmm. Completeness is rewarded when major decisions are not made until both partners

[00:10:06] are in oneness of spirit. It feels like a very strangely worded yes, no, yes,

[00:10:13] or no, yes, no sentence. So you're not complete if you're making major decisions apart to be

[00:10:23] complete and to have the reward of completeness. You need to make major decisions together.

[00:10:31] I think generally speaking, it's a good idea in marriage to make major decisions together.

[00:10:37] I mean, I could see there an argument for being in agreement like you're not in agreement

[00:10:42] if you're making decisions apart but just saying you're not complete if you're making

[00:10:49] decisions apart, I don't know. That seems... It's a little strange. Yeah, I don't know.

[00:10:57] I should post that video I did about dating advice back during the pandemic.

[00:11:04] That was all about completeness too. Mm hmm. That was a good one. I'll try to dig that up

[00:11:11] and post it to social media. But that's it. So like, to be complete, don't have sex, don't eat,

[00:11:20] pray, pray some more, don't lust. And I guess that's it?

[00:11:28] It's not even this... There's not a whole lot there. Why is that even part of the book

[00:11:35] or the relationship advice from Bill? I don't know. But next week, we're going to talk about

[00:11:41] fruitfulness, like being fruitful and multiplying. So you got to have sex somewhere to your point,

[00:11:47] Kyle. Apparently, you are having sex for the next one. Okay. Yeah, you can have sex again.

[00:11:56] Maybe you can even eat. Are you complete at this point if you're being fruitful or not?

[00:12:02] I don't know. I guess we're going to have to find out. There's a lot to this one.

[00:12:07] I'm a little nervous about it. Oh my gosh. It asks questions like,

[00:12:13] is the world facing the threat of overpopulation? Is the world running out of vital natural

[00:12:19] resources? Interesting. And then some other stuff I'm a little nervous to see here. More

[00:12:27] hidden messages from God, which really means Bill. Next week will be a doozy. I just can't with him.

[00:12:38] Oh my god, Bill. All right. Well, we'll get into fruitfulness next week. What do we...

[00:12:45] listener questions do we have to answer today? Okay. So this is going back a while from

[00:12:51] a listener named Jamie. This is about the episode I did about when the case against my brother went

[00:13:00] to court, so four years in court. Wasn't Kim Foxx the one who went after R. Kelly? So

[00:13:07] Kim really Foxx dropped the charges against R. Kelly. He was charged with, I think,

[00:13:16] trafficking. So he was, yeah, found guilty of racketeering and sex trafficking

[00:13:23] from decades-long allegations of sexual abuse of women and girls. This is from Business Insider,

[00:13:30] an article from January 31st, 2023. So she decided to drop the charges against R. Kelly

[00:13:37] because justice had been served in federal convictions. So he got 70 years, I think,

[00:13:44] in federal court, but she didn't pursue... So she just dropped the state charges then

[00:13:51] since he was getting federal charges. I have mixed feelings about that. She says it was to

[00:13:58] use resources for victims who did not have the power of a documentary to bring their abusers

[00:14:06] to light, which seems a little callous. I understand if you have limited financial

[00:14:15] capabilities like needing to prioritize cases where there aren't any federal convictions

[00:14:22] to put that person in prison, but I know that was devastating for the survivors.

[00:14:29] I don't know. That's a tough one. That's a tough one for me to answer. I don't really

[00:14:36] know what she should have done. Well, I mean, the answer is yes. She dropped the charges against

[00:14:41] him. Yeah, she did drop the charges against him. Whether or not she should have is

[00:14:46] a much bigger question. So you guys tell us what you think. And then another one is from

[00:14:55] a listener named Ariel. Have you heard of promise keepers? My dad went to a couple of those men's

[00:15:03] conferences when I was growing up. Yes, I think Rick was part of that. I think promise keepers was

[00:15:10] like how to be a man who keeps his marriage vows and is a good husband and father and all this

[00:15:19] stuff. I think that's what that was all about. It was very much like headship, male,

[00:15:25] spiritual leadership focused. I don't know tons about it. And then Ariel asks a second question,

[00:15:33] how would you go about sharing information like this podcast or digging up the duggers with

[00:15:38] someone who's still kind of in it but doesn't recognize it? Do you just let them be? Can

[00:15:44] you take blinders off someone else? I don't know. I want to be a help, but in the right way.

[00:15:50] And I'm not sure there's a way to start someone on their way out. Oh man, that is a good question.

[00:15:58] Kyle, what do you think? I think I have my answer to this one. I mean, I think that's one of

[00:16:05] those things where it's something you'd have to do gently. But I do think, especially

[00:16:12] in cults and there's varying levels of how bad cults are, obviously there could be some very

[00:16:19] bad things going on. So obviously if you care about this person or if you didn't care about

[00:16:24] this person, you probably don't want them to be in a cult anyways. But yeah, I guess if you're

[00:16:29] trying to nudge them, you can be a little inconspicuous and just be like, oh, hey,

[00:16:38] look at this cool podcast I've been listening to. This reminded me of you. Obviously they might

[00:16:45] figure it out after that, but you did it. They have to get to episode 53 to hear this conversation.

[00:16:55] I don't know. It's one of those things where you're trying to be subtle and sometimes the best

[00:17:02] way of doing that is to not be so subtle, but just still accomplish what you're trying to do.

[00:17:09] There's a term in education called scaffolding where you slowly build on the knowledge base

[00:17:18] with the learner. So you're supporting them and you're holding their hand a little bit less

[00:17:24] with each step. I think that people did that for me as I was coming out of the cult.

[00:17:32] It took a lot of those smaller moments of people saying, oh, that's weird. Or wow, why would you

[00:17:41] think that? That's not something I've heard before or in so many words, that's not normal.

[00:17:47] And eventually there were enough of those moments that they started to click.

[00:17:52] So did anybody ever just blatantly say, hey, your childhood sounds super messed up.

[00:18:00] It sounds like you were in a cult or your family was in a cult or religious.

[00:18:06] They never said cult, but they did say, wow, I have people in my life who are like, wow, Amanda,

[00:18:12] your parents are really messed up. I was at Christian college, so we didn't say fucked up.

[00:18:17] But your parents are really messed up and I think they were wrong

[00:18:21] in how they handled that and all of their views about purity culture and your dating

[00:18:28] relationships and controlling you in your 2021 and everything with your brother.

[00:18:36] But those were people who were close to me and had that access to me and had built

[00:18:43] up a solid enough relationship with me that they could say those things.

[00:18:47] So I think a lot of it depends on your relationship with the person. Do you have

[00:18:54] that rapport with them? Do you have the capital with them to make those kinds of statements and

[00:19:01] ask those kind of questions? And then I would say just there's repetition and do it slowly

[00:19:10] over time. Yeah, I wonder like I would think it would

[00:19:14] matter whether you believe the person wanted to actually get out of that environment.

[00:19:19] Try to nudge them like, hey, you might be in a cult if they're all in and are bought into it.

[00:19:29] That might just strengthen their resolve because you are the evil outsider who's trying to sway them

[00:19:34] from their connections just like the leaders said would happen. Better stand alone for Christ.

[00:19:41] Yeah, but I guess if you think you've heard them make comments about this doesn't seem right,

[00:19:46] but they keep going along with it, then you can probably be a little more obvious and say like,

[00:19:51] hey, I've heard this other religious cult thing and it sounds a lot like what you're,

[00:19:58] some of the stories I hear from you.

[00:20:01] And if you think about this and maybe bring them into it, I don't know.

[00:20:06] Yeah, I think if they're super zealous, it's still worth saying subtle things because

[00:20:12] you know if that pile gets big enough over time, like if you think of it as, I don't know,

[00:20:17] the image that comes to mind like putting a pebble in a bucket

[00:20:20] that they're holding every time you do that, eventually that bucket's going to get pretty

[00:20:25] full and then you'll be like why whoa what's with all these pebbles in this big old bucket

[00:20:30] that I'm carrying around. So how would you have reacted if somebody just like straight up told

[00:20:35] you like hey, I've heard you mentioned Bill Gothard. Bill Gothard has a cult

[00:20:40] and there's some crazy shit out there and like I think you were part of that.

[00:20:46] It just made me more righteous when I was younger honestly. So my relatives weren't quite that blunt

[00:20:51] but they would say things like, I don't know, they called it out a lot like they didn't like the

[00:20:55] homeschooling, they didn't like the having as many kids as you physically can without any

[00:21:00] thought to how you're going to feed or clothe them like they had concerns and they were very

[00:21:05] vocal about it but that was just persecution and Jesus said we were going to be persecuted and in

[00:21:12] fact it was just a sign of the end times because persecution was in fact increasing.

[00:21:18] So what happens if you would have had those comments when you were in college?

[00:21:22] Well, I mean that kept happening and by then my pebble bucket was heavy enough that I was like

[00:21:27] okay I need to do something about all these pebbles so yeah it's cumulative I think.

[00:21:36] So number one I would say is assess your relationship with the individual like how much capital do you

[00:21:42] have with them, how much report do you have with them? Two, assess their relationship

[00:21:47] with the cult. Are they hyperzealous? Have you heard them questioning some things or

[00:21:52] are they just going along with it because that's what their family, their parents, their

[00:21:56] partner, whatever is doing and then you could probably actually be more forthcoming if they're

[00:22:03] wavering and I would say less forthcoming if they're superzealous because you will only feed into

[00:22:09] their righteousness and their idea that they're being persecuted. Blessed are you and men revile

[00:22:16] you and curse you and something something for ye shall inherit the kingdom of God.

[00:22:21] That's also from Matthew five, six or seven I forget.

[00:22:26] So that's Ariel, I hope that helps that's how I'd handle that.

[00:22:31] And then we have a question this is good from Megan. What is with IVLP and cult members especially

[00:22:38] women and the word encouragement? Anytime they are saying something nice about someone it's

[00:22:45] you're such an encouragement as the number one thing. I think we saw that Ms. Shiny Happy People

[00:22:51] docuseries too like the encouragement was. I mean you can't tell her she's smart because we can't

[00:22:58] have that. You can't tell her she looks nice because also she's then she's got an eye trap

[00:23:03] going on somewhere so we can't have that either. So you can tell her that her countenance shines

[00:23:10] for Christ or you can tell her that she is an encouragement to people which is like super neutral.

[00:23:18] It's like so neutral. You're just such an encouragement to people it's so encouraging

[00:23:24] to have you around or on the team or in the kitchen. So they just interchange that with

[00:23:30] like a good influence or like you're such a woman in the cult the way a woman in the

[00:23:39] cult is supposed to be per bill and all the men. So you're in line you're doing the right thing.

[00:23:47] So you're upholding the the oppression of women in the cult. Yes. Interesting.

[00:23:54] That's so listeners like weigh in that's how I interpret it. I remember hearing that growing up.

[00:24:03] I don't know if anyone called me an encouragement Kyle.

[00:24:07] Probably not. You're a little rebellious to be an encouragement Amanda.

[00:24:15] This is probably true. And then Brittany in the episode about being productive and working

[00:24:23] tirelessly I realized that the biblical principle of Sabbath was not mentioned.

[00:24:29] I know Bill cherry picked the Bible to death and got his own purposes but I'm curious how or if this

[00:24:38] practice of total rest for a full day each week was present within the cult while endless work was

[00:24:44] the primary focus in order to be morally superior. I think bill worked on the Sabbath.

[00:24:50] So Sunday we were not supposed to work everything on the cult compound

[00:24:58] shut down. I don't know if the kitchen was even open like I think everyone was supposed to fast

[00:25:03] and pray or something but my older siblings who lived on the compound usually came home for the

[00:25:10] weekends and they ate so they did not participate in that when they weren't there. And if anyone

[00:25:20] remembers am I right about the fasting on Sundays I feel like that was a thing or at least one of

[00:25:24] the meals was fasted or something and they like you were supposed to do as much prep as possible

[00:25:30] Saturday so that your focus could be on the Lord on Sunday and church and all that kind of stuff.

[00:25:35] If you worked in the normal world not for the cult you couldn't work on Sundays that was a really big

[00:25:43] deal. That is also part of why it was so hard for me to work in college to pay my bills. I remember

[00:25:49] this recently like what was the other really big reason I struggled to make money in college? It

[00:25:54] was because I couldn't get jobs because I had to tell them I couldn't work on Sundays and no one's

[00:25:58] going to hire someone who can't work a whole day of the weekend. Oh yeah I mean that's when

[00:26:03] most places hire college students or high school kids like because they'll work the weekends when

[00:26:09] they don't want to work. Yeah so that was a whole thing and like I know a lot of Christians say

[00:26:17] that we live in the Sabbath now so every day is the Sabbath. I don't remember hearing that until

[00:26:25] I got to college so I don't think the cult taught that. So when they said work what did in the cult

[00:26:34] did they mean like you can't go to a job and work or like you can't go outside and rake the leaves

[00:26:42] because that's work? Well if they said that then we definitely broke it because we did house projects

[00:26:48] all the time. Yeah I think oh man we usually went to morning church and evening church and then we

[00:27:02] moved so that was when I was younger and then when we moved and started going to the cult church

[00:27:07] then we just had like the four hour service every Sunday morning and then four hours.

[00:27:12] Yeah this is hell. I don't think there was much more to it than that like I think ideally you just

[00:27:26] read your Bible and prayed and fasted all day on Sunday but that wasn't even like super strictly

[00:27:33] enforced because Bill I think worked on Sundays. Somebody would have died in the Baptist church we

[00:27:39] definitely ate on Sundays that was like services over food time. So yeah that if anyone else remembers

[00:27:50] more about that especially on at like headquarters please remind me. All right I think we got time for

[00:27:58] one more question. Okay let me look okay the next one then that we'll do or the final one we'll do

[00:28:07] is from April and April says I was raised Southern Baptist in North Carolina and the way I was taught

[00:28:14] was once you are saved you can never lose your salvation. My question is how does IBLP view salvation?

[00:28:21] I know that some Baptists believe that you can lose your salvation as in backslide into hell

[00:28:27] so I'm curious as to how IBLP teaches this. Oh man I gotta dig deep for this one okay

[00:28:35] I huh I think it was once saved always saved but if you acted like you weren't saved then maybe you

[00:28:45] weren't saved the right way in the first place so if you were saved the right way it was always saved

[00:28:52] but if you weren't saved the right way it would show up eventually in your behavior. So there was

[00:28:57] a loophole for it to be questionable but it was once saved always saved. Yes of course it

[00:29:03] was complicated. Yes I think so again listeners who grew up IBLP correct me if I'm wrong about that

[00:29:10] but I think that was I think that was it but I also know I heard backslide into hell a lot and I

[00:29:18] am having trouble remembering if that was the cult or if that was my conservative college

[00:29:23] because they didn't there were a couple things they didn't agree on I think the cult was more

[00:29:27] Calvinist and college was more dispensational and so I don't remember which one goes with which

[00:29:35] with some of this stuff but I think it was if you're saved the right way you're saved forever

[00:29:40] and if you're saved the wrong way it'll show up eventually and you'll go to hell.

[00:29:45] Well I remember hearing you tell stories that like you were always concerned about that though

[00:29:50] I was always concerned I wasn't saved the right way because you had to be it had to be

[00:29:58] like so many different things to be the right way and if I sat and let myself think about it

[00:30:07] I could probably write a little list of all the things you had to do to be saved the right way

[00:30:12] but yeah I was I lived in constant terror that I wasn't saved the right way

[00:30:18] and I would end up in hell.

[00:30:21] That sounds right for the cult. Yeah. We're gonna save you kind of maybe.

[00:30:29] Yes, yes. Tell you do something wrong and then we're gonna question it and tell you

[00:30:34] you weren't saved the right way. Exactly that is exactly right welcome to cult mentality.

[00:30:42] Yes, cult mentality 101. Oppress everyone. Make them live in fear. Yeah have a way to scare them.

[00:30:54] Yes and you know a lake of fire is a really great scare tactic as it turns out.

[00:31:02] Well let's end I have a question let's end on this one. Okay.

[00:31:06] And this is just kind of related to that like how much did you guys go into like the whole

[00:31:11] revelations thing because I know that like some denominations of Christianity like focus way

[00:31:18] more on revelations than others and like what was so much. So much. Yeah. Yeah. So it was

[00:31:30] always fire and brimstone. So much and the mark of the beast there was so much about the

[00:31:34] mark of the beast I was terrified of the mark of the beast. I'm shutting my laptop. Okay.

[00:31:39] I do not know how to tell you. I would like check my body on a pretty regular basis

[00:31:47] to see if I had the mark of a beast and like one time. Oh what was it? It was like a burn or

[00:31:54] a bug bite like there was something and I think it was on my arm and I was like terrified

[00:31:59] that it was the mark of the beast and then like every time new technology came out that was

[00:32:06] actually the mark of the beast. It wasn't it wasn't going to be my space is the mark of the beast.

[00:32:12] It went from being like a physical stamp on your skin to like they were really they were

[00:32:18] they were convinced we were all going to get chipped by the government and that was the

[00:32:23] mark of the beast. I'm sure they were very afraid of that. Yes. Like tracking. Yes.

[00:32:28] Being tracked. Yes. In any form or fashion. So like I think I remember like vowing to never get a

[00:32:35] government chip because it was the mark of the beast or something. It was something we talked

[00:32:42] about way more than I think we should have with young children especially like the monsters

[00:32:49] that Revelations describes and the horsemen and I don't know they're the chariots and all of the stuff

[00:32:57] of death and doom and the battles and blood rivers of blood and

[00:33:05] yeah demons lots of demons and a lake of fire and being cast into it forever

[00:33:11] and and like screaming in agony as you burn in a lake of fire forever.

[00:33:18] So they went all in on the scary details of that then. Yes and then my non-cult church

[00:33:26] oh one last thing I guess growing up the church we attended until they let evil satanic rock music

[00:33:34] into the church they would do this thing oh my gosh what was it called

[00:33:39] it was it was something heaven or hell or but it was like a play and they would have people

[00:33:47] play the roles of angels and demons and it was like judgment day before God. So they would have

[00:33:56] you know someone come in before whoever was playing God or however they did that I was never

[00:34:02] allowed to go children weren't allowed to go it was too scary like literally they banned children

[00:34:06] from watching this so they would like bring a person in before God and then God would decide

[00:34:13] if they were going to heaven or hell and if they went to heaven like oh the angels would welcome

[00:34:18] them and if God said go to hell like I remember because Andrea did this the angels had to like

[00:34:23] throw their hands up over their eyes and look away and like the demons would come drag the

[00:34:29] person like screening into hell wow that was church that was their like evangelism tool

[00:34:39] I'm sure it was very impactful yes in all the wrong ways yes

[00:34:45] so the cult no no wonder I had so much work to do in therapy as an adult

[00:34:53] she's really makes a lot of sense anyways all right well that's uh it's a good way

[00:35:02] to complete this in marriage wait we have to circle back your instructions for the week again just

[00:35:08] heterosexual married people only because I guess no one else matters according to bill um don't eat

[00:35:16] pray a lot don't have sex and don't pray while having sex

[00:35:22] or do um and that is how you will experience completeness in your marriage this week amen

[00:35:33] see you next week for how to have so many kids but maybe also practice abstinence at the same

[00:35:39] time we don't know but we'll find out thanks for listening to another episode of the cult I left

[00:35:45] behind until next time don't join a cult if you enjoyed this podcast please like share and subscribe

[00:35:52] and we will catch you on the next episode